While we hear about abuses, human rights violations, harassment, criminal conduct and “fair gaming” in the Church of Scientology, I have been very satisfied with the service I received in my 25 years being a member. Others have lost money, time, careers, family members, unborn children or even themselves. I lost none of that. But I did lose something. And it took me by surprise.
I was nervous as a child. Worrying about stuff – mostly social situations. I was shy, terrified to be asked to read aloud in class. There was often a cocktail of emotions, blood pumping, adrenalin, fear, uncertainty and doubt. Amid the social stress was a boy seeking refuge in hard core natural sciences where I could satisfy my appetite for knowledge and master the crafts. Logic and reason was safe. Emotions not.
When I got into Scientology in 1984, I was seeking new answers and new angles to particle physics and astrophysics. But they offered me a path to gain control of those unruly social situations. I was intrigued to learn that I could gain some level of mastery of shyness, stress and my worrying.
From the very first communications drills and all the way up Scientology’s Bridge to Total Freedom I was longing for less worrying, more control. Mastery of emotions, of self, of stress and of the worry.
And lo and behold, that was just what I got. In spades. No wonder I was happy with my Scientology services. I went from a worrying and shy boy to a radio show host to a CEO of several companies and a renowned public speaker. I got exactly what I wanted.
But be careful for what you wish.
I am seldom stressed or worried. I can be thrown headlong into any public situation, be it impromptu speaking on an unknown subject or going on radio or TV without preparation. No stress, just a pure “Fuck It” attitude to whatever the situation may bring.
I miss the stress. The anticipation of the unknown. The adrenalin. The rush. Much zest have been lost. If anything, that is a source of some worry.
This is why I seek situations where I am not in control. That is why I want challenges beyond my abilities to cope. I need to feel more of those emotions, that part of life.
It is harder and harder to find exciting challenges. If you have any ready, please throw it my way.
In hindsight, I would still do it all over again. Because the benefits of calmness and harmony outweighs the loss of zest. But it is a loss that I am very much aware of.
(From my heart, pure text, no graphics or even links. Delivered as-is.)
Geir Isene - uncut 
Get on my blog with a calm attitude of discussing knowledge and you’ll find plenty of challenges.
.
I am not looking for intellectual challenges. Got plenty of that. I am looking for real life emotional, out-of-control rushes.
Got it. For me, there is no bigger challenge than the challenge of discovery.
.
Scientology doesn’t help one to master their emotions, life, etc. – it actually does the complete opposite, it shuts them down by putting you in a ‘comfortable’ little trance state. Real mastery of emotions and life come from following you own path and intuition, which there is no script for, thank god.
Which is exactly what I am doing – following my own path. But still… I want to go to outer space (Virgin, SpaceX) or do more sky diving or host a crazy TV show… or Something.
How about climbing. You don’t have to start with Everest; there are many other equally challenging climbs. Off the top of my head I can think of no other activity that over time can be so demanding of both mind and body. Litterally having to challenge yourself to take each new step. I know Galdhøpiggen isn’t much of a challenge, but with your love of travelling going to Italy or Switzerland wouldn’t be out of the question.
However, if you ever would get to climb Everest, what will you do next? How can you top that?
Hmmm…. pondering
Didn’t you once do Kilamanjaro? 🙂
You could top that by doing it again, and again and again which no-one has done to my knowledge. When you have done it 25 times, I’ll eat my own hat…
Ha ha – that was just an inside joke, Per :D. But I love that you didn’t question it. We might say that the confidence he gained and puts out into the universe comes back to him – in the form of confidence of others in him. You know, the “law of attraction.” (Marianne has had an influence on me. ;))
Great and yes… I know most laws from breaking them – often… that way you learn deeply and quickly..
Ain’t it da truth. 🙂
Da bleedin trusj…
Now it’s gettin’ deep in here. 😉
Of course – we are serious people – aren’t we ??
Haha..Geir, just on a whim, break the law of time by stopping pondering! I wonder whose idea will be the winning one for a challenge!
Scientology done at a ‘conceptual’ (mind) level can sure leave one in a trance state as the subconscious part of the mind is in ‘trance’, also the part of the analytical also (my view, when data are from the ‘past’). In my experience, as it happened to me, when you get to be aware of that ‘space’ (no-thingness) which you are, the ‘spell’ of trance is gone…you can then observe and LIVE your emotions, or rather, the emotional layer. Another point is that real ‘cognition’ is with a LIVE ability that you live in life.
doug: Real mastery of emotions and life come from following you own path and intuition, which there is no script for, thank god.
Chris: Good post. You said a mouthful!
Hi this is my first blog on your site. I would suggest that to recover that feeling of not being in complete control and a little fearful,Ride a motorcycle.This does it for me every time. Im an oldtimer going back to the mid fiftys. I get just what you mean.
Thanks, Pete. Neat suggestion. My girlfriend already has a license to ride a motorcycle. She would be thrilled if I got the same and we could go for rides together 🙂
Until then, Geir…
HI again. One of the trips I did was ride up to the nordcap at the top end on the main road north.Fabulous! Great road shellgrip surface. The tyres clung to the road like cack to a blanket. Great fun playing catch me if you can with the boys in pale blue, The guys who got caught had to pay hefty fines.But still great fun!
That’s bizarre, I was thinking the exact same thing. Great suggestion.
Wow, Geir, nice post. I did feel it from your heart. 🙂
How about Having a New Jersey background, with California flair (immediate rejection on both parts) , living in the dirges of North Carolina, wanting to start up business to help others get in business and working.
Glad you survived Scientology, Geir, and have spiritual peace. Most OTs I know live in a shell, afraid to look and think, emotions shut down, cut-off from life, financially ruined and deeply in terror of the Cof$.
I know. I am always looking for opportunity to help them.
Madora
You mean the persons you mention have not yet confronted SURVIVAL for real. That is, they still hold onto the consideration of ‘must survive’, in life, of course.
Dear Geir,
You want challenges? We can rent a boat or borrow one, and I’ll give you some “heavy” challenges on direct survival if you are up to it!! How much sailing DID you do so far?
Haha…love you, Per, you know it! Yeah, a couple of months ago me and Alanzo advised Geir a little backpacking tour….yeeeeaaah! Geir, you and some other guys
just start off from Norway…the winter is the best!!! Cold! No planning for the trip…
I did a similar, although by car three years ago to the sea. Lots of, lots of surprises, challenges and absolutely amazing people!
And yes, some sailing with you Per….HaHa…take this offer, Geir!!!
Done perhaps 8-10 weeks full time. Maxed at close to 40 knots worth of wind and around 5 meter high waves. That was really cool.
Looks great mastery and control…Per speaks about heavy challenges and direct
survival!
Per?
Were YOU the skipper and ultimately responsible?
Yup.
Good, then you know what I’m talking about.. Are you tempted? There are much more challenging stuff than what you went through !
Yes, I am tempted 🙂
I cast one vote here for Per and his idea, also one vote for both of you guys that together you can come up with plenty more ideas out of which one can surely be realized!
YOU speak for the first time on your blog. Yes, there have been several posts: Loss, learning and gains, Harmony and some others….but this is the first that
sounds ‘complete’. Non-dual, close, intimate. One. Life. Thank you for sharing the
YOU.
As for the lack of zest and challenges, some understanding of this ‘state’ and practical advice will follow…
Geir…if you reallly, really!! got it that it is all space…even zero!! (which you did as you wrote numerous comments about QP etc.), how the hell can ‘you’ be in ‘control’ of any’thing’? Life is in ‘control’…Hrrrr…the ‘goals of OT’…toleration of no-thingness…I add, there is no’thing’ to tolerate. Taking apart habits…how the hell will you know about habits? You ‘listen to’ Life (intuition, flow, whatever) and if the mind says ‘go right’, you listen to your intuition and do that…the result can be whatever…sure not based on expectation and sure not evaluated…or if it is, you then can say…HaHa…the ‘Fuck it’ to the evaluative thought…
Very simple challenges: go to places in your neighbourhood where you have never been, talk to people you don’t know, try what they tell you….you sure can come up with good ones. In short: notice and cut down on ‘old’ actions and come up with new
ones when you use your mind. OR…don’t use it, as I wrote above….
Marianne, I am not the smartest fish in the pond, but are you stating the possibility of revamping old actions with new people in slightly different scenarios?
kuryzma
You are sure smart, I just looked at some possibilities, which are endless. Thanks! Like: ‘revamping old actions with new people in slightly different scenarios’, new actions with old people in new scenarios, new actions, new people, new scenarios…you can go on with the list….
If you really, really ‘listen’, whose meaning is being aware and perceiving, can you say e.g. that you EVER do the same action in the same way? A simple thing, like walking….it is VERY difficult to make an effort to walk in the same way. Just try it…
Awareness of differences instant by instant gives a certain joy to life. One simple exercise: sit in front of a mirror and observe your face…you will sure notice something which you have not seen before…you can do that with your room…with the street…etc.
I’ve done all that. Lots. I talk to people all the time – on the buss, at the airport, on the sidewalk, everywhere when I get a whim to do so, and that happens quite often.
Geir, the mest games are all boring, I would recommend playing games with persons of all the corners of life, no assumptions allowed. And I mean not just to talk, but to engage on long term games. As in recovering the kid-ness in life 🙂
‘I would recommend playing games with persons of all the corners of life.’ Yes. All. Also, top artists, top scientists. In their space and doing some activities with them, emotions can sure be expected.
Also, of ‘comparable magnitude’, other than scientology. Go and meet the Dalai Lama. Or someone, like Ramana Maharshi was.
Marianne Thot, your comment seems biased towards quality persons but Ramana and Dalai Lama would never lost much time with capricious artists or asinine top scientists. In my view, the value of a person is in his potential to be ( with your help of course ), not in his current state. Honesty and faith is the operating word.
+1
I wrote ‘all’ and ‘also’. Read my comment again. I don’t think that the Dalai Lama did not start from the ‘bottom’ and did only ‘quality’ things. Will read about his life, thanks. Also, he does not have any discrimination like a ‘capricious artist’…I am not biased, I am aware of the energy field and clearer mind of ‘top’ people…I worked and still occasionally work with some…what I mean is that when one, like Geir, who is one of the people with that pure field, may need the company of those who also have that. It is of course his decision and from his comment I see that he is of your opinion, which is fine with me. I do it differently. I agree with what you write about the potential. Thanks for your very kind and honest comment!!!!
I have no real regrets with my scientology involvement, it has made me who I am today. My ruin wasn’t gayness, it was not fulfilling my true potential. They never handled my ruin, but I did.
pedrofcuk: They never handled my ruin, but I did.
Chris: Good post. Me too. And really, that’s the only way it can be.
At this rate, Geirs going to have to go to plan a trip to the moon.
Haha…not really. He may have to learn to cook something delicious first, or wash the floor for two hours or something alike….he may nevertheless have to do that on a trip too…
Geir…we will take you apart….
‘be careful for what you wish for’ ….I say, don’t be careful for what you write….’deliver as-is’…
http://www.virgingalactic.com/booking/
hehe 😀
If you want to enjoy something you cannot control, try an Anonymous anti-cult protest.
You take the bastard offspring of peaceful protest and civil disobedience, file the serial numbers off, turn it up to 11, and push every envelope you can “for the lulz”
Come raid with us, your first Adrenalin Rush is free
I’m in.
“It is harder and harder to find exciting challenges. If you have any ready, please throw it my way.”
Re-locate to a third world country.
Alan
That is a very good idea, Alan. Except I have three kids. When they grow up, I might just do it.
I have two kids and they are doing just fine in this here little ‘ole 3rd world country at the bottom of Africa 🙂
You and I are similar in so many ways – we are both hard-core techies, we excelled in maths and the sciences, we both got into Scientology and got out, and somewhere along the way found we have real ability in talking to people and helping them get along in the world. We both care, and in the same way. I don’t really know of cource if it’s truly is 100% liek this, but it sure appears that way.
I also get the idea you much prefer communicating to individuals, or a group of individuals; being a politician or a Bolivar just isn’t your thing. Out here in Africa people face problems that would make you shudder.
Water.
That’s top of the list. Clean drinking water preferably free of cholera. Then there’s sanitation, housing, power, transport and food. And there’s no magic bullet solution, just a whole lot of little ideas that each one make someone’s life just a little easier. An amazing project that’s been around for ages is a water drum – rural women fetch water from rivers and the occasional tap and carry it home in a bucket carried on their heads. And then a fellow had on idea – take a 20 gallon plastic drum and mount a bearing on each end with a U-shaped handle like a trolley. Now the drum is a wheel and can be pulled home. And it carries much more water than a bucket.
Maybe I’m just a romantic idealist but I think you could make a difference.
Yes, we seem to be very much alike 🙂
I have been to Africa a few times (SA, TZ, Kenya), even out in the real outback (https://isene.me/2011/05/25/dont-touch-the-cows/).
As for not being able to move now; I have my three kids every other week (my ex-wife has them 50% of the time).
DO NOT UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES EVER TELL MRS SPLOG YOU WORKED IN KENYA.
Becuase if you do, I won;t have any more reasons to not buy her that coffee farm she’s always wanted 🙂
Hope she’s not reading this blog, then 😛
But hey! A coffee farm in Kenya would be swell!
It’s an excuse. Based on something like ‘they need me’, ‘I am responsible for them’ some version of it. ‘When’, ‘if’, ‘but’, ‘except’ are telling words….
Not that I am totally free of them. They are part of our web-of-life-consciousness.
Children an excuse? Nah. No way. How about a way of life and they have a choice also.
‘Children an excuse’. I did not mean that. It can be completely unbelievable but when the ‘my’ and ‘kid’ are gone from one’s thinking, also, one is away, the ‘kid’ will be more responsible. Example: some years ago I went to England. During that time one of my sons called me up that he got a job. He had been looking for a job for two months then. Anything, any time can be talked on the phone, there are planes to go back home any time. As I observed it, when one’s mind is off the child, one’s hm. what is the word…..I’m creating one: oneness-faith. Hm. ‘me’ well, doing whatever, the ‘child’ is well, doing whatever.
In brief: the clearer one’s mind is, the better it is for the ‘child’ as the child perceives it as it is all ONE. My experience.
I asked My kids if I can go to Africa. I was told sternly ‘No.” Yep. We have oneness in this home. They own me. I am at their beck and call. I choose to not break the agreement we have based on a whim. Oneness., 🙂
Haha…love your answer, kuryzma! Completely got it! Also, being ‘owned’ can be fun in certain parts of Life…
I will disregard this respons beyond stating that I think it is stupid.
Ok, Geir. Can sound stupid. Part of it also. What I know as a ‘mother’, some of my earlier joys, fears…emotions, that is, can be found in my two kids. Some have disappeared from them when they have disappeared from me. They kind of ‘feel’ my
mood, state of being even if we are physically apart.
In brief: I am quite aware of the fact that when I gave birth to my two kids, I passed certain emotions and certain patterns of thoughts to them which I had picked up during my childhood both from my ‘parents’ and the ‘surroundings’ = collective subconscious, that is. Happens quite mechanically in human life. I find it also true that if a child has a problem, a mental issue, the parents can possibly have that too. So, as I observed it, when a mental issue was gone from me, it happened, not always, that it was gone from my children too. Why? Because I stopped creating ‘their’ problem which I had agreed to being a problem for them, in their lives.
It is interesting to see in the above the use of the word ‘have’. Havingness, that is.
A problem is a havingness. No problem, loss of havingness to that extent. As I see it, it is a point where ‘true’, not conditioned havingness starts. Perceiving in a new way. Living in a new way.
Geir, you wrote earlier, if I remember well, that you believe that a child ‘chooses’ the place where it is born. Will you say a little bit more of it, how you see it?
Geir are you saying that you got everything you wanted and now life is not exciting enough for you.? Forgive me if I dont have much empathy for you, you poor thing. And as Marion said, be careful what you wish for.
I know. But I am not looking for empathy. At all. I am looking for crazy challenges. And also a slight warning to those who want to keep the zest in life above harmony and calmness. Got it?
For me zest and harmony can go hand in hand. ‘looking for crazy challenges’…great! When the challenge is over, then the next, the next…Do not all the ‘wise’ say that the problem is wanting? The mind pattern of wanting and looking
for. It is not a philosophical question…very practical. The challenges in the physical-human world are endless. The ‘spiritual’ experiences, the beyond the mind ones…hm. they are there, Geir. Can be very challenging also. Creativity, true creativity comes from that realm…me just had some glimpses of what a really wise one can do…also, the body is still here and enjoying the human challenges too.
Adya speaks about the clear mind, ‘dryness’ (lack of adrenalin), he calls it a ‘limbo-zone’…UNTIL a new type of ‘energy’ arrives…I find it true, in my experience. This is the beginning of the Heart stuff.
What you wrote reminds me a bit of what first got me into discussing about SCN this year, in your blog and later Marty’s. I was upset about TRs –that the way I did them and saw some others doing them made us to sort of be suppressing emotions and thoughts, so as not to get flanked. And I had noticed some stone cold attitude from myself and others too, as if we used that to avoid being effect. But if you avoid effect in general, you avoid the good effects too. And generaly, it is not an as-ising action.
🙂
😛
So as not to get flunked. Yes, I had that too. As I see it, it has its root in the fear of not doing something right, as expected, being invalidated, even being punished.
Very, very logically, if someone with intuitively natural communication skills sits down to do the TR-s, doing them ‘perfectly’, will that person have any concerns of the above? So the concerns have an earlier root, in one’s childhood, in school, in life.
Perhaps because of my personality, also a bit of earlier buddhist retreat, where emotions could be played out, also because of the superb SUPs I had, I did not suppress my emotions and thoughts. I even cried once that I could not get over
3.0. So, I was given a Clear Book One auditor as a trainer and was asked to do the
Mood Drills. Also, some other people were asked to come to the org and help me.
In return…hm…I remember once I trained a SUP…I was surprised when he communicated that he had not been allowing several people to enter his space…hm. space sort of cold and solid…lots of emotions were coming out of him in that cycle, fear, tears, anger. Just spontaneously. The Course SUP let it happen.
So spyrosillusionist, what can you do? Do that cycle again, like that SUP did. If you haven’t yet done it. Emotions can be totally free, in my reality.
Ahoy Marianne 🙂
When I say something about SCN, unless I specify it, I don’t mean that it is incorrect from it’s root, and that it cannot be used correctly –for benefit. I explained something that I have seen in myself and some others. Sure, TRs -in theory- don’t say you ought to be stone cold. Nor to say ‘I understand’ while you mean ‘F$£”$£ you %$£%$ *&^*£$%’. Nevertheless, I saw that often. And also the way I did TRs -I’m saying stuff I’ve said before- did ‘make me’ more comfortable with communication –truth be told. But I also built some walls –ridges, and they were tough. Probably because I did TRs for about 100 hours overall, which I don’t understand anyway. TRs are drills, not a substitute for processing. And I think all that are worthy to mention, as that phenomena I didnt see in myself and 2-3 others alone. And saying something -apparently- against the tech, doesn’t put me against the tech and doesn’t make me an infidel, heathen, lowtoned, SP etc. If you’re afraid to say something ‘against’ the tech, kiss KSW 1 and intergrity goodbye….oops that’s already happened. I care thus I’m bad. 😀
I like ARC, but true ARC. When somebody acknowledges because he thinks he ought to do it, I don’t agree with it. Or when he appears cheerful while he isn’t cheerful, I don’t like it either. Those are blocks in ARC, and don’t contribute to understanding. They can be used in fake PR, but I’m not into that.
Me: because I did TRs for about 100 hours overall
Me: Only 100? Correction: around 200.
You wrote that you’ve been very satisfied with the service received in the Church within 25 years.
As you describe you’ve taken out a lot from the tools Scientology offers.
It shows that what is being offered is much more than what Claire Headley and Tony Ortega suggest while guiding the public through the different steps of the Bridge.
But there is more: You did not only write that you took much profit from the tech but also evaluated the service at Flag to be very satisfying.
I have not heard this before. And I cannot understand your evaluation as I have experienced very much unprofessional service. It is just everywhere and therefore I believe that everyone is confronted with it.
It already starts with the hotel. You find out that the telephone does not work and that your electronic key has not been programmed correctly to open the door.
Once the printer in the business center did not work for weeks since Flag was unable to get hold of the proper cartridges (back in 1994).
And what I did experience in a Chaplain’s Court cycle had been just a concentration of unprofessional and arbitrary behavior, a nightmare.
Well, I was and am a critical person, not hesitating to complain when I read about a very high standard and I then find out that this is just PR.
Reading your post I first thought: You’ve been a good client to the Church who paid for your services up to OT VIII, probably made donations here and there, never complained about the arbitrary and abuses you witnessed, even helped OSA to handle critics, never said “No, Sir!” until you had completed OT VIII. You were a little VIP, so Flag tried very hard to please you.
Then I remembered Tiziano Lugli’s story.
Why did he run into unprofessional staff, arbitrary and different kind of shit again and again? His parents OT VIII, his father privileged to take care of the Scientology pope’s well designed suits…
Had it been easier for you than for Tiziano to progress on the Bridge as you just jumped from success to success while Tiziano had a more difficult ‘case’?
Or was Tiziano more critical, sometimes daring to say “No !” when he would not agree with something or would not tolerate what he witnessed?
I wonder what the reasons are.
I am very clear about where my boundaries go. But I am not a critical person at all. I love experiences of all types. I embrace life and value when people try their best even when they fail. I liked Flag, even in hindsight.
potent and inspiring discussion.!thanks 🙂
I always suspected that you’re a bit nostalgic about “good old” Sci days 🙂 …It’s no reason to have regrets, Geir…You’ve lost adrenalin, rush, stress, but you’ve gained normality. Be grateful 🙂
Geir, it is great you lost that insecurity. I have heard Toast Masters accomplishes the same thing
Geir, it is wonderful that you gain confidence and the ability to talk in front of people. I truly mean you no disrespect but that same quality can be accomplished by going to Toast Masters. A FREE class and group that helps people speak publically.
I met a man who told me his friend was always afraid of people, a wall flower until he went to Burning Man and now he is an extrovert. His friends were blown away at the change. The ticket for Burning Man is about $350.00
Paying thousands upon thousand upon thousands for a trait that can be accomplised in other processes and therapies does not, in my view, flatter your position or Scientology’s effectiveness. Especially when the stated goals are far more fantastic.
Brian
Geir had money to pay for and ‘lose’ in one sense…also, can create that. My view.
Guess some of you will disagree, even Geir. And yes, one can do that with no money, or a little.
Marian, I think it’s wonderful that Geir has the moola to create. My point is: if Scientology would promote public speaking and personal confidence for $100,000 to $300,000 would that be seen as a rip off. And would that sell.
As much as these attainments of confidence are wonderful, somehow, to me, it does not seem praiseworthy regarding Scientology.
Buying a book on healthy eating, that brings health when applied, can be considered of great value. But if the book cost $200,000, to me, I would consider it a rip off if the same info could be gotten from another book for $19.95.
Something seems…….. Radically unreasonable about the size of price to virtue attained ratio. My view is not a judgement on the value of confidence, it is a judgement of the validity of the attainment to price ratio.
That’s just rediculous in my view. Not that Geir is happier. That’s wonderful.
You seem a bit desperate to compare apples and pears. Because it is not Only about confidence in public speaking, but I guess you might have seen that if you followed me more.
Brian
‘Geir has the moola to create’ it works just the opposite way…one creates, whose part is communication and one can have money. If one wants it. In my view, creation and communication have different manifestations, from the subtly fine (art) to the crude effort (physical work). Behind all forms, there is energy creation. The communication course, especially the TR-s have a full range of the human communication and creation, even the ‘theta’ (spiritual). In my view and experience.
I don’t know any book, any course that can do that, although there can be, of course. After the Upper TR-s I can communicate with anybody. It had also the result
that I can perceive ‘energy’ manifestations better. Also handle them, as e.g. with
a singer before her final performance I could help her turn her attention to very subtle ways of singing, she said, her teacher never did that. This example is one of
the possible results of this course, which, if one truely got it and practices it, can be
infinite (my view again). So it was well worth the ‘money’, also the joy of the ‘ability’…I never ask for money, as in the example. I love this activity, that’s the why.
To be continued….
Marianne, excellent post! It’s a great example of how different people get different things out of Scientology – depending what they bring to it. Even so, the TRs including upper TRs are truly unique in that most people benefit quite a bit. Actually, the TRs contain the very foundation of Scientology. And pretty much contain the basics of the universe too. 😉
Hmm me having some bad experiences linked to them must mean I’m a little devil, then 😛
Everyone already knew you were a little devil. 😛
Yes, buying a book on healthy eating that brings health when applied can be considered great value. For the ‘lucky’ one that health can last a lifetime. It can also happen, that one needs to buy a lot of books. The thing is, in my view, that if one ‘understands’ what health is, in any ‘spiritual way’ where one can experience it, it is also worth the money.
The money I spent in scientology ‘came back’ in multiple ways in my case. Though, I did not get ‘far’ in it, so I cannot say more about it.
As for ‘confidence’, the meaning of the word is ‘faith, trust’, which can be VERY deep. It is not an intellectual, mental stuff. It goes deep down to the core of LIFE, who and what we are. I personally don’t know any better, any more beautiful life-purpose than experience that deeper and deeper. And I mean it.
Money…symbol of trust that what one gets for it as an exchange is and will be worth
as much, or even more than one gave for a service (one definition of it). A hot issue. Would worth a blog post from Geir. Geir?
I liked the intellectual challenges that were presented in the Books Scientology 8-8008 and The Phoenix Lectures. There were some very good insights there (which probably came from Hubbard under the influence of drugs) and some very bad additives (which probably came from Hubbard NOT under the influence of drugs). A bad additive is that MEST comes from THETA.
Anyway, it has been quite a fun to go over these materials and separate consistencies from inconsistencies.
.
The answer why it is not an ‘intellectual challenge’ is in 88008 itself. Also, in the History of Man and 880. It was Ron who wrote about it in his own way. You can find
a lot which is written there in true Eastern ‘practices’ as experience, rather than explained by thought.
Money was never a stop in ‘my days’. I joined the SO and got it all for ‘free’. My exchange was my work which I loved to do. And I did it all.
Great comment.
All is a big word.
Yes, all is a big word. In this case it covers all the services I received encompassing: Dianteics Course, Academ 0 – IV, SHSBC, Class VII Interneship, Class VIII Course and internship, Class IX Course and internship. OEC Course, FEBS Course, 3rd – 1st class mission school, Auditing: Dianetics through OT Vii (full). Purif, SS 1 and 2, Ministers course, HPSC, All R/Ds invented up to 1982 and OK to audit them. I guess that this is ALL…
I can imagine you guys singing like they do on a sailing boat…
Dear Marianne,
I don’t know how to upload files here, but if you send me a private mail (to per1909@gmail.com) then I will mail you a sea chanty I wrote some years ago which is song by Amos Jessup (S.O. veteran).
Love
Per
Will be the gift of the day for me! Thanks so much, Per! Sure will send you an email.
Thank you for doing it all and thank you for sharing it.
Love
Marianne
Ah, all of Scientology. Got it. I was going down the wrong track.
OK – wlcome to My Track, which was Whole too…
Here’s an idea for Geir:
+5
Geir, here is another idea… Get into the C of S and cramm the hell out of them, and we will follow, I guarantee you, we will boom those places. How about THIS? Is this big enough for you, enough DOINGNESS to you?
Of all the things Geir could do with the rest of his life, being connected in any way with CoS is probably very near the bottom.
He’s made it clear over the past several years that he is done with Scientology as a subject, and done with CoS as a group.
Yup
I know that, that’s why it is a really, maybe only challenge, that would mean something actually..
It is certainly interesting, the different viewpoints on scientology and flag I get from reading all the different blogs. In one sense I feel it has to do with the persons innate spiritual make up, the experiences they attract to themselves.I do not mean to imply everything that happens to you is your own falt but you do play a part in it. Geir you seem like such an open and accepting person so that is what you recieved. I, on the other hand can be somewhat the opposite. I went to flag for 2 weeks once and waited the whole time for my folder to come back from the CS. I am a patron of the IAS and had donated a lot of money for service. I wrote it up nothing haooened and I never went back. Too bad, I always wanted to go clear. I also did not find flag to be a very friendly place. But I am glad some people got what they paid for.
In Scientology there was the idea that ‘nothing can happen to you, unless you postulate it’. So, according to that, it’s nobody’s fault, but it’s everyone’s cause.
Geir says: I am looking for crazy challenges. And also a slight warning to those who want to keep the zest in life above harmony and calmness. Got it?
Last spring I realized that more than anything, Scientology has been more about disconnection than anything. I had been seeing disconnection in terms of the severance of familial and social relationships, but that is only the the outward, physical manifestation. There is a very real and even more powerful internal or subjective mechanism of disconnection. It is what makes disconnection possible.
What is a release? What is a blow? What is happening when one “as-ises” an engram or incident? What happens when a button is flattened? When exteriorization occurs? What I notice is that each and every one of these are a form of disconnection from something unwanted.
I was going down a path of disconnecting from everything unwanted.
What I didn’t understand, until well into it all was that in a particular life circumstance, if there is something wanted, there is inevitably something unwanted. Simply disconnecting from unwanted produces a result of being disconnected from the wanted as well because as much as the unwanted has little effect on one, so does the wanted have little effect.
In psychology, this is called dissociation. Its effects range among numbing, depersonalization, disengagement, emotional detachment,
In particular, emotional detachment is very much a result of Scientology processes. In psychology this is seen as both a positive and a negative outcome, the positive being:
“Emotional detachment in the second sense above is a decision to avoid engaging emotional connections, rather than an inability or difficulty in doing so, typically for personal, social, or other reasons. In this sense it can allow people to maintain boundaries, psychic integrity and avoid undesired impact by or upon others, related to emotional demands. As such it is a deliberate mental attitude which avoids engaging the emotions of others.
This detachment does not necessarily mean avoiding empathy; rather it allows the person space needed to rationally choose whether or not to be overwhelmed or manipulated by such feelings. Examples where this is used in a positive sense might include emotional boundary management, where a person avoids emotional levels of engagement related to people who are in some way emotionally overly demanding, such as difficult co-workers or relatives, or is adopted to aid the person in helping others such as a person who trains himself to ignore the “pleading” food requests of a dieting spouse, or indifference by parents towards a child’s begging. Emotional detachment also allows acts of extreme cruelty, such as torture and abuse, supported by the decision to not connect empathically with the person concerned. As a result, the decision as to whether emotional detachment in any given set of circumstances is considered to be a positive or negative mental attitude is a subjective one, and therefore a decision on which different people may not agree. ” [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emotional_detachment]
It would be a dull movie if we anticipate the plot, and the outcomes are completely predictable, if we refuse to suspend our disbelief, if we deliberately and constantly refuse any unwanted experience such as crying, fearing, being exhilarated, being foolish, etc. In other words, we are disconnected. Deliberately choosing to not be affected.
I read a powerful book about a year ago, and have been working with the ideas in it, for it parallels my own findings in this. The book is “Broken Open” by Elizabeth Lesser. You can listen to a talk by Elizabeth on the core concept here:
In exploring this I have learned that I lost my connections, even my wanted connections and with that my vibrancy. I have gone a long way to restoring all that – I love it – to feel monumentally is amazing!!
Just lately I encountered a wonderful book called “Women who Run with the Wolves” and it works through the concept as well, I even set up a blog post about it and featuring a number of videos with a fellow who also explores the “wildish” nature of humanity.
Here’s the blog post: [http://mariatempleton.wordpress.com/2013/10/06/the-power-of-the-wild/]
I am finding that it is in the world of myth, and poetry and dense, visceral feeling that life begins.
It is at least part of the key for me!
Like a lightning strike shattering the tree bowed to the ground in furious rain and battering wind, these moments of gut wrenching maelstrom rip open the fabric of my life and open raw vistas of agony and joy shivering through all that I am…
Maria
Much food for thought. Thanks, Maria.
Yes, as she says let yourself be vulnerable. As it goes a little deeper, there you find
innocence, innocence of the Heart itself. A little deeper is the courage of the Heart itself out of which the spontaneous, creative actions and words arise. No mind, just as Life. Natural. If you are that with another person, this opens the door to the Heart
of the other as one is then very simple and very natural – this is the power of our core nature. Truth of being. Transparency. As I have experienced it, it is true power.
Mindless, selfless – true ‘connection’…when it is really ‘deep’, there is no ‘connection’ either, as one can then feel that though the ‘form’, the ‘actions’ are different, it is actually One Life. The perception of it is no-division, also can be vibrant, kind of playful, dancing, embracing. Can’t put it better, words stop here.
Thank you, Maria, what you write is beautiful. I have felt this core connection
with you since I started posting. Will reflect to what you write, as there is a way too
lot in it. The above is the spontaneous first reflection of your….love out of which you wrote your post. Thank you.
Maria, cannot write more with words now. It is a very powerful, very inspirational post. It helps me look at a lot of things ‘opening raw vistas…’. Thank you….
Wow! Great perspective. Suggests to me a triad of sorts: life as dominated by games conditions, life as perceived from “outside” the game, and immersion by choice. Too much of any leg of the triangle and we lose something essential. Too many games conditions and we lose the ability to be at cause, we become pushed around by the choices presented to us in the games we find ourselves stuck in. Too long outside the game and we lose the ability to derive meaning, enjoyment, fulfillment from games. And too long immersed and we could, conceivably, eventually lose the randomity which makes the game a challenge.
Also, I’m jealous (in the positive sense closer to “inspired”) by all of you who got in the CofS – and got back out – before all the overts came crashing back in on LRH and the org. If those commenting here are any example there were definitely some useful real life skills and models being taught there.
I love this video!
Hi Geir,
Very very very interesting. I had the exact same “problem”! Do read the book Seven spiritual laws of success by Dr. Chopra. Very small book and the 6th law (if I remember well) may be the key you’re looking for.
Denis
Thanks, Denis. I will check it out.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Seven_Spiritual_Laws_of_Success
Yes. There are a lot of subtleties in it. E.g. With ‘intention’, ‘purpose’, the ‘uncertainty’ is lost. With that the experience of situations, people etc. one has not conceived, intended with the mind, yet they are there to be explored. Less joy, less unexpected challenges…
To be personal, receiving the Care and Love of Life Fully is not yet complete here…though I have experienced it many times and very deeply that Life cares more than I am aware of it. Giving is strong, receiving…hm….full trust, full uncertainty, full unknown. Could be the complete no-tool and free use of tool condition.
I have lost much of my humanity, my warmth, my joie de vibre, but I think it comes with the territory, reaching a deep calmness and freedom has a price: Takes you out of the game. And once you look at it from outside, is difficult to introvert fully in it again.
Now I tend to find myself trying to appear human, not so much for me but to avoid hurting people close to me. I constantly create this human appearance, but I´m not very good at it, and sometimes it shows: I´ve lost much of my interest in this game.
Can Scientology be blamed for this? I don´t think so, even if Hubbard lied about his clear being a vibrant, warm human being, it is always one´s own decision to get out of the game, as it is to find, or create a new activity which will draw our full attention in again.
Nobody
You haven’t lost your warmth…this is one of the warmest writing since I have been on the blog for one year now. Humanity…hm. you mean the old learnt and conditioned ways? ‘It’s difficult to introvert fully in it’….why should you do that? Hm. aloneness….I wouldn’t change it for any…I am sometimes with some, who are like me…aware…be….act but not from ego-purpose…
‘Not so much for me but to avoid hurting people close to me’…yeah…a little ‘deeper’
is that vibrant, spontaneous, knowing no-thing which when ‘acts’…hm…haha…can
surprise the non-existent self…it is also that can create.
Lovely Nobody! Cannot express better with words the perception and livingness here…as a response to what you write…and our aware-whatever-live-no-live states can be different ‘experience’….
‘I have lost much of my interest in this game’…HaHa…what makes you think that many others haven’t either, just they are not as conscious as you are? I observed an interesting thing: when I am so aware that I start to ‘pretend’ to enter a game, it happened many times that others kind of ‘stopped’ it…saying in no time that they ‘get me’ (life and light ‘postulate’), so I ‘went back’ to spontaneous and aware-nobody-nothing…HaHa…it looks that the no-game state IS that ‘humans’ want…when one is present, being (they are words…even not that but cannot use better ones) this is that changes the ‘human game’….
There is an absolutely vibrant, live flow…for me it looks that it is always and everywhere is….what takes this perception away from me is when the body gets ‘tired’ or when I am in the energy fields of ‘dense, solid’ persons for a long time…leaving them and the place, the ’emptiness or the aliveness’ returns…
And here is the absolute proof of it, that you (partly) being in a no-game condition is the most INSPIRING ever. Simple, honest, warm words. Since I read what you wrote, newer and newer angles of life have been pouring…also examples I recall who and why were warm in scientology….it looks now that they are the ones who were doing it for just doing it…no ‘personal reason’…no ego….curiosity…sharing for the sake of sharing.
Thank you for writing your post. I love being in your ‘company’….
‘ I have lost much of my……joie de vibre’
Be more with the ones who have that. True ‘enlightenment’ exists. A truely ‘enlightened’ one can show you a ‘mirror’. Alive, vibrant, out of the ‘calm, free’ no-thing. One is then both human and not human.Go and meet physically with persons who are alive, vibrant. Have you ever wondered why some, who got very ‘far’ meet a ‘realized’ one as the last ‘step’? Perhaps because after the tremendous
spiritual shifts, experiences, even seeing that in fact nothing and ‘no-body’ ‘exists’, some experience what you…’knowing’ most of the games. Human, mental, spiritual. The next ‘step’ is the unknown…the source of true aliveness…change..if anybody, some who are still ‘here’, appreciating, loving and enjoying ‘humanness’ are the ones who help bring about change…
You may listen to this…from 5.0 especially…
‘I have lost much of my….joie de vibre’ how can you ‘lose’ LIFE? Sure there can
be some ‘others’ who ‘go’ into one’s ‘space’ for ENERGY…see this video and be less with and say NO to the ones who do that…that is part of Love-Compassion…the result is sure a little bit of more aliveness in the ‘other’ one…I do this when ‘love’ does not work…a ‘NO’ to stupidity can at times be a complete YES to life in another…
P.S. Most lovely and warm nobody….part of the above may look to be advice. It is not meant to be. This is partly how I live. Partly. Works here, may not work for you. I don’t know. Today I went to buy some vitamins, to a shop owned by a ‘clear’. She is vibrant, energetic. We talked a little as always. She said she had started with the Tao. Since I have known her, she has always been warm, caring and smiling. I looked at why there were differences between one ‘clear’, ‘OT’, why is it that there are indeed some who are ‘colder’ than the others…hm. personality? upbringing?
choices while on the Bridge? deep unconscious survival need though OT6? second
dynamics unfulfilled purpose?….some I saw…my reality, can be mistaken….sure partial truth, as I cannot know.
Please write on, I loved reading your comment. Thank you.
Hey Geir, wonderful that you want to look for challenges. At your age nothing can stop you and if your work supports, then all is well. Now when you grow older like some of us, me in particular. Every day is a challenge (and a gift) and Life throws curves at me steadily. Health, computer, house, work. Knowing one has limited years left and wants all things to be in good order, and goals at least partially seen, before its end. One, like me can just about keep up. So enjoy the new challenges available to you now. I’ve got my hands full thank goodness, but understand where someone like you are coming from. I see your future very full and mine too (says the whisperer in my head, hee, hee). 🙂
The biggest ‘challenge’ the biggest ‘thrill’ is going to be when you truely and newly find yourself being creative in its blossom. That can also give back the fun-feeling of
exploration. Please ‘throw it my way’. I do now as much as I can. This is a blog, different than live-life. If I have one big idea, I will share it with you. Until then: yesterday I was with VERY high-tone, calm but vibrating people. There was a lot of ‘inspiration’. That is: be more in the company of inspirational persons.
I’m not as fond of scientology as you are, and I sincerely have doubts on the functionality of many of its teachings and methods, but I acknowledge there is at least something that actually works: the development of personal communication skills.
Which is no wonder since communication is something that scientology really depends on. Its expansion and its very existance rely on the ability of its members to communicate at all levels (speaking in public, peer to peer, etc.). Hence, communication training has to be efficient.
About the stress you miss and the excitement you want to regain, have you ever considered visiting Guatemala (my country of origin and residence, by the way)? Read about it in the newspapers. Gee, man! Fucking party all the time!
(Sorry, is it OK to swear here?)
No fucking reason not to swear if it’s pertinent – and yours seems perfectly OK. So, Guatemala… YES. I will come. Will you be my guide?
BTW; Have you done any Scientology at all?
Are you really coming? (By the way, I hope the party thing was understood as an irony. Guatemala sure has some of it, but I meant that it’s a really stressful and challenging place to live in).
Yes, I was a scientologist for about three years. I studied several courses, but I was never audited.
I will come. When? Yet to be determined 🙂
OK. Then I guess I’ll be seeing you.
hypertexta
HaHa…reading Geir’s answer your com sure had an impact on him! He very rarely says a YES and almost never after such a short com cycle. You are sure a YES guy! Do you work in art?
Well, I’m glad to hear (or read) that.
Yes, I write some (in Spanish).
By the way, did you read my answers to your questions? I hope they’re OK.
Yes, completely OK. I don’t know why I did not answer, I always do, seems it was so OK that there was nothing else to say. What do you write?
I write mostly short fiction. I also have written some poetry, short essays and a blog (that for the moment is down).
hypertexta
Thanks! Cool! I felt from your style here that you have some artistic talent. Do you have any of them in English? Also, do you draw or paint as well? Or some acting? Singing? Or did so? (haha…by the way, your picture is very interesting with the hat)
No, sorry. I don’t have any in English right now. I did some drawing and acting in my school days. The gravatar is a photocomposition of an alien mixed with a Blues brother and it’s from a back cover of one of my books.
Thanks. ‘Right now’. You may have later! I sensed somehow that you did some drawing. I like your gravatar! Back cover of ‘one of my books’. One of…how many do you have? A writer here in disguise? You see, it did not take long to find out that you write well. When one can, one cannot hide that.