A question about responsibility

What could be the consequences of shifting responsibility for something oneself has done over to something or someone else?

Please share your answers and views 🙂

2015-06-29 21.48.10

Update 2016-02-04: With the good comments received on this, I have one conclusion that is relevant to the Scientology Bubble:

There may be many factors why we see so many OTs in the Church of Scientology that remains so blind, get into trouble in life and generally does not have any marked positive impact on society. But I propose that one significant reason is that from OT 3 and up, OTs are indoctrinated into the belief that what is wrong with them is not of their own doing. It is the doing of “entities” (spirits) attached to their bodies and messing up their lives. I firmly believe that one is responsible for one’s own thoughts and emotions and that life will gradually slide into the ditch when one habitually shifts responsibility for one’s own thoughts and emotions over to someone else. Especially when those someone elses are figments of a “guru’s” imagination. I believe Hubbard was a pussy that didn’t take responsibility for his own life and tried to get his congregation to agree that his troubles were not his own. Much like Miscavige.

31 thoughts on “A question about responsibility

  1. In a nutshell, Geir? Persistence of the altered “truth”! There would likely NOT be a resolution, (or reduction) of consequences! The “lie” would have to be maintained, leading to a chain of even MORE consequences, as a result of having masked (through lying) the primary act of having been “cause” (responsible), for any given act or acts, or FAILING to act when one ought to have.

    Or as one lawyer once said: “Get away with whatever you can — Just DON’T get caught!! ” 😀

  2. If you shift the Responsibility, you’re stuck with it from there on out.
    Just my opinion based on personal experience. 🙂

  3. First thoughts:

    It’s an act of trust.
    You will have less to do and be more free.
    You will be tested in how good you are in letting the responsibility go.
    The thing the responsibility is about will change. Here are risks and opportunities.
    You will have free capacities, which might be a good thing.
    Shifting responsibility will make you responsible for the shift. This might be hard work.

  4. So with these good answers as background – what would be the consequences of not taking responsibility for thoughts and emotions you yourself create?

    1. Well, the obvious answer is that your thoughts and emotions occur more in a uncontrolled way showing a lack of self mastery.

      So how would one do this?

      Taking responsibility for them is IMHO taking something akin to the Stoic view of looking at them philosophically – in a detached manner. Then, as they rise and fall one can create the emotions one wants and insert them into the mix.

      If you are sad, you put on some upbeat music. Think some good thoughts. At first it will be 80/20 sad to glad but eventually the mood can shift.

      If one is angry, label it “anger” and the same for shame. Both of them have a four pronged compass of reactions we typically take.

      FOUR PRONGED COMPASS OF SHAME AND ANGER AND HOW WE TYPICALLY REACT WHEN ANGERED OR SHAMED.

      Attack Self: “I suck!”
      Attack Others: “You suck!”
      Withdraw: “Adios, gotta order my baseball cards.”
      Block: “Hand me a beer yo and let’s get hammered.”

      If one thinks bad thoughts, one can use Cognitive Behavioral Therapy to point out what those thoughts are and what emotion created them. And then choose something different.

      And choosing what one wants to think in response helps.

      People wonder why I never blow. My teenage step-daughter once said she never saw me get mad and wondered how the hell I did it.

      My ex-wife was my very willing mentor. I either got good or got buried.

      1. In dealing with the compass of shame and anger, the trick is to JUST CONFRONT THE EMOTION and not act out one of the four responses.

        And then create an act of virtue. I use Pythagoras’ definition:

        1. See what is in your power.
        2. Make a rational choice with good contemplation.
        3. Act deliberately.

        1. “1. See what is in your power.
          2. Make a rational choice with good contemplation.
          3. Act deliberately.”

          This is good wisdom. Generationally, it seems to be worked out and resolved in a recursive and self-similar way.

          Wisdom seems to not be carried forward simply because it has been once worked out. Rather it seems eternally to be worked out. . . like the tip of a growing ice crystal or a plant growing from its tip.

          1. It’s from the Pythagorean source book, the collection of all the scant, ancient writings on the sect.

            I like your crystal analogy.

            It really goes well with Stoic Logic. Stoic logic uses an if/then structure rather than “fact a + fact b = fact c. It allows for logic to be applied to unknown quantities.

            Then one can really act more wisely from the position of ignorance.

            “If an Santa really does exist, then I should be nice to all Santans because they can deny me gifts at Christmas time, and a new red sled is nifty.”

            AND

            “If Santa doesn’t really exist, then being mean or curt isn’t going to help Santans and I still may not get presents. Most likely cognitive dissonance will appear. So, being nice to all Santans makes sense.”

            AND

            “I hold the value that one should not disparage a person’s religious beliefs as it is usually a pointless pursuit. So I will opt to choose to be nice as it is a better thing to do.”

            CONCLUSION: Be. Nice. To. Santans.

            Ho! Ho! Ho! YO!

            Ho! Ho! Ho!

            1. “I like your crystal analogy.”

              It seems to me a fact that man doesn’t learn, man doesn’t move forward because information is discovered or learned. Each man seems to need to learn knowledge individually in order to produce propagation of knowledge. Mankind doesn’t become responsible because a man becomes responsible. Responsibility seems to be a character trait which is grown.

  5. There may be many factors why we see so many OTs in the Church of Scientology that remains so blind, get into trouble in life and generally does not have any marked positive impact on society. But I propose that one significant reason is that from OT 3 and up, OTs are indoctrinated into the belief that what is wrong with them is not of their own doing. It is the doing of “entities” (spirits) attached to their bodies and messing up their lives. I firmly believe that one is responsible for one’s own thoughts and emotions and that life will gradually slide into the ditch when one habitually shifts responsibility for one’s own thoughts and emotions over to someone else. Especially when those someone elses are figments of a “guru’s” imagination. I believe Hubbard was a pussy that didn’t take responsibility for his own life and tried to get his congregation to agree that his troubles were not his own. Much like Miscavige.

    1. Life is not “solved” by becoming an all powerful cause IMHO it is to be played inmersing joyfully in all its ups and downs
      That instability leads sometimes to marvelous New places

      1. Fully agreed. But statistically – the OTs we see makes no visible splash at all. And that’s odd and needs an explanation. Investing that much in self improvement, almost regardless of the method should – statistically – make a group stand out somehow.

        1. “statistically – the OTs we see makes no visible splash at all. And that’s odd and needs an explanation. Investing that much in self improvement, almost regardless of the method should – statistically – make a group stand out somehow.”

          Therefore another paradox, of which you’ve pointed out many. You know what I think of those.

  6. Comment: I am thinking that everybody is not only fully responsible for his own thoughts and emotions, but also for his own actions, creations and perceptions.

    Personal consideration: I am always fully responsible for my own perceptions, emotions, thoughts, actions and creations, therefore if I shift responsibility to someone else, I am creating the experience of being the effect of doing it. So I am causing smt against myself…

  7. ***What could be the consequences of shifting responsibility for something oneself has done over to something or someone else?

    ***I think that when a person is shifting responsibility for something he has done over to something or someone, he is being cause of the consideration that somebody or someone else is a cause and therefore it could became a reality. IMO, the person is also lowering his will, ability and opportunity at same time. He is creating the illusion that he is not a cause, but in reality he is a cause of being an effect. 🙂

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